Official Death Before Dishonor (Las Vegas 9/22) Thread

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alexsmellzzz
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Official Death Before Dishonor (Las Vegas 9/22) Thread

Post by alexsmellzzz » Thu Jun 15, 2017 12:20 pm

Image

PPV / iPPV / VOD
Local Time: Friday, Sep 22, 2017 06:00pm PDT
Sam’s Town Live
5111 Boulder Highway
Las Vegas, Nevada 89122

- ROH World Title - Cody (c) vs. Minoru Suzuki
- ROH TV Title - KUSHIDA (c) vs. Kenny King
- ROH Tag Team Titles - The Young Bucks (c) vs. The Motor City Machine Guns
- ROH Six-Man Tag Titles - The Young Bucks & Hangman Page (c) vs. TBD
- Six-Man No. 1 Contender's - The Briscoes & Bully Ray vs. The Kingdom
- Last Man Standing - Silas Young vs. Jay Lethal
- Street Fight - Punishment Martinez vs. Jay White
- Chuckie T vs. Marty Scurll

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Figured I'd start this up. I'll be there both nights front row. Hope they have some New Japan guys this time around. They really spoiled us with Ishii, Tanahashi, Goto, and Okada in previous years. Last show here was awesome with Daniels title win, but I do like the shows a little bit more when there's some NJPW guys on there.

If you're coming in from out of town, or even if you're local and want to watch another show on Sunday night, Future Stars of Wrestling always runs the 3rd night of the weekend of these ROH double shots. And they're doing it again on Sunday, 9/24. Event page for that is here: https://www.facebook.com/events/1932512290301226/
Keith Lee and Brian Cage are already on the card, and it'll probably end up being another stacked one like last time. I think last time they had AR Fox, Shane Strickland, Keith Lee, Cage, Sami Callihan, and some other guys. FSW cards aren't typically that stacked, but the post-ROH cards are the best ones they do. Idk if ROH scouts those ones, or what the deal is, but everybody works hard on those shows.

WWE also has Smackdown here the week prior to that, on 9/12 at Thomas and Mack Center.

monster mafia
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Re: Official Death Before Dishonor (Las Vegas 9/22) Thread

Post by monster mafia » Thu Jun 15, 2017 12:34 pm

too soon man lol

alexsmellzzz
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Re: Official Death Before Dishonor (Las Vegas 9/22) Thread

Post by alexsmellzzz » Thu Jun 15, 2017 4:39 pm

monster mafia wrote:
Thu Jun 15, 2017 12:34 pm
too soon man lol

Tickets are on sale for all of these events, except the WWE one. So uhhh... not really. If anybody wants good seats, they should get em now. My bad there's not a Youtube video you can post yet lol

Big Red Machine
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Re: Official Death Before Dishonor (Las Vegas 9/22) Thread

Post by Big Red Machine » Thu Jun 15, 2017 5:43 pm

Does Delirious have a special friend in Vegas? Because that seems to be the only explanation for why they keep wasting PPVs on a small building that is very far away.

monster mafia
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Re: Official Death Before Dishonor (Las Vegas 9/22) Thread

Post by monster mafia » Thu Jun 15, 2017 5:50 pm

Big Red Machine wrote:
Thu Jun 15, 2017 5:43 pm
Does Delirious have a special friend in Vegas? Because that seems to be the only explanation for why they keep wasting PPVs on a small building that is very far away.
i think that's not lizard man choice...

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Re: Official Death Before Dishonor (Las Vegas 9/22) Thread

Post by famicommander » Thu Jun 15, 2017 7:32 pm

They're obviously getting something out of the Vegas shows, otherwise they'd stop doing them. Maybe they want to maintain some sort of foothold in the western part of the country, and Vegas is one of the most accessible destinations in the region. Give the fans out here a bone. Vegas is the closest drive for me to see an ROH show and it's about 12 hours if I speed my ass off the whole way without stopping.

Hopefully we hear some news on how this Tribune merger affects ROH. Maybe they could start running cities like LA, Denver, SLC, Phoenix, Seattle, Portland, etc if there were TV visibility beyond Comet (that's the only way to watch it besides the internet here in Denver). ROH coming to all those Tribune local affiliates and their national feeds (WGN, thisTV, Antenna TV) would be huge.

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Re: Official Death Before Dishonor (Las Vegas 9/22) Thread

Post by Big Red Machine » Fri Jun 16, 2017 7:08 am

famicommander wrote:
Thu Jun 15, 2017 7:32 pm
They're obviously getting something out of the Vegas shows, otherwise they'd stop doing them. Maybe they want to maintain some sort of foothold in the western part of the country, and Vegas is one of the most accessible destinations in the region. Give the fans out here a bone. Vegas is the closest drive for me to see an ROH show and it's about 12 hours if I speed my ass off the whole way without stopping.

Hopefully we hear some news on how this Tribune merger affects ROH. Maybe they could start running cities like LA, Denver, SLC, Phoenix, Seattle, Portland, etc if there were TV visibility beyond Comet (that's the only way to watch it besides the internet here in Denver). ROH coming to all those Tribune local affiliates and their national feeds (WGN, thisTV, Antenna TV) would be huge.
I'd at least like to see them try to run a building that isn't so small for a PPV. I have no problem with western shows It's just the Vegas market that hasn't grown. They should try running the Bay Area or San Diego or LA or Seattle.

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Re: Official Death Before Dishonor (Las Vegas 9/22) Thread

Post by cgstong » Fri Jun 16, 2017 9:21 am

Big Red Machine wrote:
Thu Jun 15, 2017 5:43 pm
Does Delirious have a special friend in Vegas? Because that seems to be the only explanation for why they keep wasting PPVs on a small building that is very far away.
SBG has channels in Vegas and most likely the ROH show does well in the ratings there plus Sam's Town isn't that expensive though the building is kinda cramped from when I went there for their PPV but it still works.
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Re: Official Death Before Dishonor (Las Vegas 9/22) Thread

Post by kovs27 » Fri Jun 16, 2017 9:46 am

cgstong wrote:
Fri Jun 16, 2017 9:21 am
Big Red Machine wrote:
Thu Jun 15, 2017 5:43 pm
Does Delirious have a special friend in Vegas? Because that seems to be the only explanation for why they keep wasting PPVs on a small building that is very far away.
SBG has channels in Vegas and most likely the ROH show does well in the ratings there plus Sam's Town isn't that expensive though the building is kinda cramped from when I went there for their PPV but it still works.
I was going to say, Sam's Town is an off the strip casino so I'm sure it doesn't cost that much. It is a bit small, I was surprised when I first saw the set up having been there to watch Monday Night Football years ago.

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Re: Official Death Before Dishonor (Las Vegas 9/22) Thread

Post by Big Red Machine » Sun Jun 18, 2017 3:51 pm

kovs27 wrote:
Fri Jun 16, 2017 9:46 am
cgstong wrote:
Fri Jun 16, 2017 9:21 am
Big Red Machine wrote:
Thu Jun 15, 2017 5:43 pm
Does Delirious have a special friend in Vegas? Because that seems to be the only explanation for why they keep wasting PPVs on a small building that is very far away.
SBG has channels in Vegas and most likely the ROH show does well in the ratings there plus Sam's Town isn't that expensive though the building is kinda cramped from when I went there for their PPV but it still works.
I was going to say, Sam's Town is an off the strip casino so I'm sure it doesn't cost that much. It is a bit small, I was surprised when I first saw the set up having been there to watch Monday Night Football years ago.
That would definitely help them keep overhead down, but does it balance out the cost of flying their guys farther? it seems to me like the company's goal right now is to stand pat forever, so them doing something like either running a bigger building or abandoning markets haven't drawn so well like Vegas or Florida in favor of trying somewhere new would be a sign that they're trying to do something.

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Re: Official Death Before Dishonor (Las Vegas 9/22) Thread

Post by alexsmellzzz » Wed Jun 21, 2017 5:01 am

ROH is on tv like 4 or 5 times a week here in Vegas. You could argue the market isn't "growing" because they're not running bigger buildings, but they run smaller shows in half empty buildings in the midwest all the time. What wrestling markets ARE growing? The New York shows do well, Philly shows do well, well surprise surprise, those markets were established long ago and will always be strong. In Vegas, they get a small-medium sized building that looks great on tv, it's an off-strip casino that is likely VERY cheap, I mean, it's really a win-win for ROH all around. Plus it's like a vacation for the guys. And the last PPV was sold out with no New Japan guys on the card. People in here implying the Vegas shows haven't drawn well are not really telling the truth. The tv doesn't do as well as the PPVs, but I'm fairly certain every PPV has been sold out. And the crowds are loud as hell every time.

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Re: Official Death Before Dishonor (Las Vegas 9/22) Thread

Post by kovs27 » Wed Jun 21, 2017 5:35 am

How they mic the crowds is still an issue. When I go to shows in NY and Philly the places are very loud. It doesn't come across that way on tv. Certain guys are way more over than you can tell if you are only watching and not attending.

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Re: Official Death Before Dishonor (Las Vegas 9/22) Thread

Post by alexsmellzzz » Wed Jun 21, 2017 6:02 am

Yeah I honestly don't rewatch the shows after they happen, so I couldn't give an opinion on that. I remember hearing that complaint after the first PPV, though.

Already signed for the FSW show that Sunday (9/24): Brian Cage, Keith Lee, Jeff Cobb. Going to be a good one.

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Re: Official Death Before Dishonor (Las Vegas 9/22) Thread

Post by Big Red Machine » Wed Jun 21, 2017 3:18 pm

alexsmellzzz wrote:
Wed Jun 21, 2017 5:01 am
ROH is on tv like 4 or 5 times a week here in Vegas. You could argue the market isn't "growing" because they're not running bigger buildings, but they run smaller shows in half empty buildings in the midwest all the time. What wrestling markets ARE growing? The New York shows do well, Philly shows do well, well surprise surprise, those markets were established long ago and will always be strong. In Vegas, they get a small-medium sized building that looks great on tv, it's an off-strip casino that is likely VERY cheap, I mean, it's really a win-win for ROH all around. Plus it's like a vacation for the guys. And the last PPV was sold out with no New Japan guys on the card. People in here implying the Vegas shows haven't drawn well are not really telling the truth. The tv doesn't do as well as the PPVs, but I'm fairly certain every PPV has been sold out. And the crowds are loud as hell every time.

Not many I will admit. Pittsburgh has been. Dallas as well, but those are the only ones that spring to mind without doing heavy research. On the other hand, Vegas has got more (lacking a better term) special incentives to show up that many other markets haven't. Since they started going to Vegas regularly they've only had one show that wasn't TV or PPV and that show still had Nanae Takahashi, Austin Aries, and a one-night TV Title #1 contendership tournament, plus they've gotten New Japan guys pretty regularly. In other words, they've always either gotten special attractions or a show that actually mattered. Pittsburgh, Indianapolis, Columbus, Collinsville, Hopkins, Lockport, Dearborn, and Florida rarely- if ever- get that (SCOH doesn't count because ROH doesn't, lacking a better term, "control" where SCOH is). I realize that Vegas is not alone in this special treatment. The same can be said about NYC, Philly, Chicago, Toronto, Nashville, Baltimore, and Boston as well. But ROH draws better in most of those markets than it does in Vegas. It's an issue of opportunity cost. If you keep selling out in Vegas, try a bigger building. And if the overhead in Vegas is low enough that it's not worth it to try a bigger building, then mix some regular shows in every once in a while use the appeal of PPV to dry to draw better somewhere else.
It's not just an issue with Vegas. There is no reason that they haven't tried to find a bigger building in Milwaukee at this point, either, and at this time last year I'd have told you the same thing about San Antonio, and would understood if people felt the same way about Baltimore. The same thig was happening in Providence a few years ago, IIRC.
When it comes to the markets they run ROH is way too happy to stand pat. If things are looking up, they don't make any sort of change to build off of it, and if things are going down they don't make any sort of change to help that, either. They don't try running bigger buildings or running more successful markets slightly more often (San Antonio and Nashville possibly being exceptions), and if they draw a bad house in, say, Indianapolis they don't change anything up the next time they're in town to try to get a bigger one. And it's not just venues and cards, either. They don't try something basic an obvious like running a one-night #1 contendership tournament as an iPPV just to see how well the idea would draw. There is an obvious issue with running TV the next night in the same city as the PPV/iPPV, but aside from doing the post Final Battle tapings in Philly last year they have made no effort to do anything different (and this has been a clear problem for four years now). They drew 850 on their first trip to Oklahoma City and never tried to go back. They'll go to a big city like New Orleans for SCOH but never even try going back on their own to see how they'll do. Surely not ALL of the WM weekend crowd is out-of-towners, right?
They seem content to just stay where they are financially and market-share wise while booking the product into irrelevancy by making the same mistakes TNA made because actually coming up with ideas is too hard for them. There is no excuse for a promotion that claims to be national to not try running LA or San Diego or San Francisco or Seattle. They should be trying this stuff and they're not. If you're going to cut down on the number of times a year you go to Chicago to try running places in the midwest then why not cut down on your trips to Vegas to try running someone on the west coast?

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Re: Official Death Before Dishonor (Las Vegas 9/22) Thread

Post by Big Red Machine » Wed Jun 21, 2017 3:20 pm

alexsmellzzz wrote:
Wed Jun 21, 2017 6:02 am
Yeah I honestly don't rewatch the shows after they happen, so I couldn't give an opinion on that. I remember hearing that complaint after the first PPV, though.

Already signed for the FSW show that Sunday (9/24): Brian Cage, Keith Lee, Jeff Cobb. Going to be a good one.
Night of the Hosses!

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Re: Official Death Before Dishonor (Las Vegas 9/22) Thread

Post by Reaper G » Wed Jun 21, 2017 7:42 pm

alexsmellzzz wrote:
Wed Jun 21, 2017 6:02 am


Already signed for the FSW show that Sunday (9/24): Brian Cage, Keith Lee, Jeff Cobb. Going to be a good one.
Matt Riddle was added to the lineup today.

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Re: Official Death Before Dishonor (Las Vegas 9/22) Thread

Post by maxx_powerz » Sun Jun 25, 2017 5:56 pm

So before the PPV I had assumed MCMG were next for the Bucks by default. But between the PPV and TV taping there has been nothing hinting at this yet.

I guess there is another TV taping before this show? The post BitW TV taping didn't seem to give many hints about this show.

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Re: Official Death Before Dishonor (Las Vegas 9/22) Thread

Post by maxx_powerz » Sun Jun 25, 2017 6:07 pm

It wouldn't be particularly interesting, but from a storyline standpoint Cody versus Frankie would make a lot of sense. Frankie picked up a big win over BC at BitW and wants to avenge Daniels's loss. Cody wants to humble Frankie for the fake BC turn after Page couldn't.

That said, I'd like them to have a #1 contender match with some young guys open the show, winner gets a shot that night, and try to "make" a new main eventer. Obviously, Cody is no Nigel and none of the young guys stand out as the next Tyler, but it worked once upon a time. Not sure who to pick to win the spot though.

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Re: Official Death Before Dishonor (Las Vegas 9/22) Thread

Post by Big Red Machine » Sun Jun 25, 2017 8:40 pm

maxx_powerz wrote:
Sun Jun 25, 2017 6:07 pm
It wouldn't be particularly interesting, but from a storyline standpoint Cody versus Frankie would make a lot of sense. Frankie picked up a big win over BC at BitW and wants to avenge Daniels's loss. Cody wants to humble Frankie for the fake BC turn after Page couldn't.

This is the sort of thing they should be doing as a main event of a non-PPV show.

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Re: Official Death Before Dishonor (Las Vegas 9/22) Thread

Post by AlexROH » Mon Jun 26, 2017 1:08 am

Yes, in July there'll be another TV Taping.

Kazarian vs Cody main eventing a PPV scares me a lot. Maybe Kaz will challenge on a TV show? Or maybe at the WOTW Tour?

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