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Re: Free Enterprise Official Thread
Posted: Sun Feb 09, 2020 6:54 pm
by McXal
She can be a fun performer, especially when fans relate to her and get beyond the silly gimmicky shenanigans...but she is not ever going to be the type of worker who can just show up and have a good ten minute (and it felt interminably longer) match with an ageing Sumie Sakai.
Debuting her in that manner just screamed out that ROH have no idea what they are doing with her or how they are going to manage the fact that she is so stylistically opposing to everything ROH is usually about.
It will be a real test of Gresham/Marty/Delirious/Bubba/whoever the hell else in how they try to manage her run in ROH. She can definitely contribute - but not like that. As I said - it was just brutal to watch. Even if you cared about what they are doing with Sumie (and I am wholly indifferent) it was tedious...
Re: Free Enterprise Official Thread
Posted: Sun Feb 09, 2020 6:57 pm
by Montana
AnHonorableMention wrote: ↑Sun Feb 09, 2020 6:19 pm
Montana wrote: ↑Sun Feb 09, 2020 5:06 pm
Haskins is great but he's missing that next level, but Flip Gordon is too, which I'll call the curse of Bubba Dudley.
The Hendry/Castle tag was awful and out of the 4 Tyler Bateman is the lone guy who should be on the roster next year, if there is one.
Alex Zayne is a star, he's a little older than I would have guessed but he's a superstar in every sense, timing, charisma, playing to the crowd, knowing where the cameras are, he's got everything from flashy moves to size. Everett was solid but he's nothing more than a utility player and a damn good one.
. .
Maff/Cobb vs Calimari & Lethal was out fucking standing. Maff definitely was blown up but man Cobb is so fucking good it hurts to see him hidden in a tag. Brilliant match, best on the show.
As for the Joe Koff promo, this guy trying to be humble wearing a 50k watch was hysterical. Also he deserves none of the credit in regards to the video library. Mark Brown, and Ian Riccaboni deserve 100% of the credit. This process has been going on for a while. if Joe and Greg had their way nobody would ever see anything that occurred before they bought the company.
Interesting thought, on the curse of Bubba. I know they tried to use to get these guys more over, but doesn't seem to work... or at least anymore than a match with anyone else.
Can't say i'd get rid of Castle/Hendry....but not sure if you meant Vincent faction, or the 4 in the match. Basically 3 of the 4 are more entertaining , and pretty good wrestlers. ROH kind of straddles the line between wrestling/entertainment. Clearly more focused on wrestling, but also having a few entertaining gimmicks.
Although i like Zayne, can't help but think, you are over rating a tad. Maybe i need to see more of the guy. I think he's got potential, and is what ROH needs, just not sure i'd label him a star just yet. Like he's really good a flips, but seems to lack the more technical side. I think ppl like Slex/Brooks will have better runs.
I'll need to re-watch Lethal/Gresham vs. Cobb and Maff... i liked what i saw, just didn't see it reach that next level.
Concerning about Koff, but at least he's addressing it, and that's a step in the right direction. Who cares if he has a 50K watch, imo. Kudos to Mark/Ian though.... I know that's one thing the fanbase feels strong on.
Re: Free Enterprise Official Thread
Posted: Sun Feb 09, 2020 7:18 pm
by AnHonorableMention
McXal wrote: ↑Sun Feb 09, 2020 6:54 pm
She can be a fun performer, especially when fans relate to her and get beyond the silly gimmicky shenanigans...but she is not ever going to be the type of worker who can just show up and have a good ten minute (and it felt interminably longer) match with an ageing Sumie Sakai.
Debuting her in that manner just screamed out that ROH have no idea what they are doing with her or how they are going to manage the fact that she is so stylistically opposing to everything ROH is usually about.
It will be a real test of Gresham/Marty/Delirious/Bubba/whoever the hell else in how they try to manage her run in ROH. She can definitely contribute - but not like that. As I said - it was just brutal to watch. Even if you cared about what they are doing with Sumie (and I am wholly indifferent) it was tedious...
You rightfully so hit on the right front, that character is not aimed at people like me. I’m not sure anything they do with her will be aimed at me.
Re: Free Enterprise Official Thread
Posted: Sun Feb 09, 2020 7:21 pm
by monster mafia
very happy about roh catalog news, finally.
Re: Free Enterprise Official Thread
Posted: Sun Feb 09, 2020 7:24 pm
by famicommander
Neither PCO nor Aldis would rank in my top 50 workers if you laid out the entire rosters of ROH, NJPW, and NWA best to worst.
They're probably not in the top 100 if you added in CMLL and RevPro.
Neither of them belong in a singles match on a card as big as Supercard. These are guys you should try to hide because they're extremely limited in the ring.
Re: Free Enterprise Official Thread
Posted: Sun Feb 09, 2020 7:30 pm
by AnHonorableMention
Montana wrote: ↑Sun Feb 09, 2020 6:57 pm
Interesting thought, on the curse of Bubba. I know they tried to use to get these guys more over, but doesn't seem to work... or at least anymore than a match with anyone else.
He may have been able to get people over if he hade himself vulnerable and shown ass as a heel. He didn’t. Thus the curse. He needs to stay off air, Maria is his next victim.
Montana wrote: ↑Sun Feb 09, 2020 6:57 pm Can't say i'd get rid of Castle/Hendry....but not sure if you meant Vincent faction, or the 4 in the match. Basically 3 of the 4 are more entertaining , and pretty good wrestlers. ROH kind of straddles the line between wrestling/entertainment. Clearly more focused on wrestling, but also having a few entertaining gimmicks.
Castle, is so hurt that he’ll never reach where he was when he got the belt. He’s lost, no sign he’s getting back what he had/where he was at. Mediocre matches. Hendry hasn’t translated and I advocated for him to ROH management directly which makes me look bad. He’s got a lot of personality but losing his ability to do unique music videos for each match has really hurt him. Vincent and his stable are just low rent. From the name to the look to the hokey balloons. It’s not for me. Nor is it selling tickets.
Montana wrote: ↑Sun Feb 09, 2020 6:57 pm Although i like Zayne, can't help but think, you are over rating a tad. Maybe i need to see more of the guy. I think he's got potential, and is what ROH needs, just not sure i'd label him a star just yet. Like he's really good a flips, but seems to lack the more technical side. I think ppl like Slex/Brooks will have better runs.
With Alex, I’ve seen a bunch of him in GCW and AAW. He’s not doing much of what made him so great which helps, less is more. He’s still very new to wrestling so he’ll pick up the little things as time goes on. For someone of his experience level and athletic background he’s a star if he can stay healthy. Think of a 2004 Austin Aries but taller and more athletic.
Montana wrote: ↑Sun Feb 09, 2020 6:57 pm I'll need to re-watch Lethal/Gresham vs. Cobb and Maff... i liked what i saw, just didn't see it reach that next level.
Big dudes tossing Gresh around and slimy heel work from Lethal. Loved this one.
Montana wrote: ↑Sun Feb 09, 2020 6:57 pm Concerning about Koff, but at least he's addressing it, and that's a step in the right direction. Who cares if he has a 50K watch, imo. Kudos to Mark/Ian though.... I know that's one thing the fanbase feels strong on.
He’s addressing it because he has nothing positive to talk about to get on air and get attention. That dude craves credit. Bad PR move to talk to your fans while looking like you’re above them. Cary was one of us, made it a point to do that. Still does. Joe has no people skills.
Re: Free Enterprise Official Thread
Posted: Mon Feb 10, 2020 12:31 am
by AlexROH
Sorry for enjoying things. I forgot that I should be an angry man who is 24/7 remembering how good a company was 10 years ago and how shitty is right now because it isn't as fantastic as it used to be lol.
And if you think I havent watch old stuff or something like that. I've watch every single ROH year and have plenty of old DVDs, if what you were trying to say is that I'm just giving these ratings because i havent watch ROH Golden Era.
Re: Free Enterprise Official Thread
Posted: Mon Feb 10, 2020 5:39 am
by indyfan
my thoughts
Shelley vs Haskins was a great technical opener. Nice arm work by Haskins. Shelley did a good job selling it. ***3/4
Vinny and Bateman vs Henry and Dalton good tag match. nothing outstanding. **3/4
Slex vs Flip Gordon. Flips awesome. Slex was good and had some good high impact moves. Surprised by the finish ***1/4.
Shane Taylor annouced he resigned with ROH
Alex Zayne vs Andrew Everett Good match. Much better showcase for Zayne. Everett played his part. though i maybe generous on the rating ***1/4
Briscoes vs Flamita and Bandido. Holy fuckin shit. What a match. Balls to the wall. Briscoes are the best tag team in the world. They need a rematch. Its been a long time since i heard ROH chant. ****1/2
Skipped womens match
Skipped most of the Battle Royal. It was cool seeing the last real man facing off with the Man Eater. Silas and Woods worked as a tag team from the amount i watched. Dragon Lee won after eliminating his stablemate, Kenny King. WTF. Oh shit, Mask comes off...Its Flip Gordon Awesome stuff
Gresham and Lethal vs Maff and Cobb. Great match and right guys won. ***3/4
didnt watch the rest yet
Re: Free Enterprise Official Thread
Posted: Mon Feb 10, 2020 6:07 am
by monster mafia
AlexROH wrote: ↑Mon Feb 10, 2020 12:31 am
Sorry for enjoying things. I forgot that I should be an angry man who is 24/7 remembering how good a company was 10 years ago and how shitty is right now because it isn't as fantastic as it used to be lol.
And if you think I havent watch old stuff or something like that. I've watch every single ROH year and have plenty of old DVDs, if what you were trying to say is that I'm just giving these ratings because i havent watch ROH Golden Era.
Amen
Re: Free Enterprise Official Thread
Posted: Mon Feb 10, 2020 9:32 am
by Lynx
I remember that when RoH/NWA thing fell apart last year they were building towards Aldis/PCO match for Summerslam weekend show. It wasn't announced, but I remember reading somewhere that this was what they had in mind. So to me it looks like they are going back to that and it will build towards Aldis/Marty II.
Only good thing here is that PCO probably is dropping the title back to Rush at Anniversary show. Ideally PCO/Aldis will be in undercard, but it will probably be, unfortunately, one of the main matches.
Re: Free Enterprise Official Thread
Posted: Mon Feb 10, 2020 10:16 am
by AnHonorableMention
AlexROH wrote: ↑Mon Feb 10, 2020 12:31 am
Sorry for enjoying things. I forgot that I should be an angry man who is 24/7 remembering how good a company was 10 years ago and how shitty is right now because it isn't as fantastic as it used to be lol.
And if you think I havent watch old stuff or something like that. I've watch every single ROH year and have plenty of old DVDs, if what you were trying to say is that I'm just giving these ratings because i havent watch ROH Golden Era.
Yo dude, chill out, no need to jump down my throat for not seeing what you're seeing. Does the term generous insult you? Christ. But yeah you overrated a lot of those if not all of those matches from the vantage point of most people. I'm not angry either dude, I just happened to find better quality wrestling elsewhere that entertains me. Remember wrestling is infinite. Your ratings weren't wrong but man they definitely tell me you are very kind with what you dig. Chill out.
Re: Free Enterprise Official Thread
Posted: Mon Feb 10, 2020 2:02 pm
by Shanahan
AnHonorableMention wrote: ↑Mon Feb 10, 2020 10:16 am
AlexROH wrote: ↑Mon Feb 10, 2020 12:31 am
Sorry for enjoying things. I forgot that I should be an angry man who is 24/7 remembering how good a company was 10 years ago and how shitty is right now because it isn't as fantastic as it used to be lol.
And if you think I havent watch old stuff or something like that. I've watch every single ROH year and have plenty of old DVDs, if what you were trying to say is that I'm just giving these ratings because i havent watch ROH Golden Era.
Yo dude, chill out, no need to jump down my throat for not seeing what you're seeing. Does the term generous insult you? Christ. But yeah you overrated a lot of those if not all of those matches from the vantage point of most people. I'm not angry either dude, I just happened to find better quality wrestling elsewhere that entertains me. Remember wrestling is infinite. Your ratings weren't wrong but man they definitely tell me you are very kind with what you dig. Chill out.
You complaining about people jumping down your throat? HAHAHAHA. Every single time anyone says anything positive about ROH you race on here to call them a shill. You passive aggressively called his ratings shit and when he calls you out for always being negative you play the victim....this gimmick is getting old.
Re: Free Enterprise Official Thread
Posted: Mon Feb 10, 2020 2:17 pm
by Lynx
It is ok not to like current RoH, but this desire to throw jabs at anyone who still likes it is weird.
Re: Free Enterprise Official Thread
Posted: Mon Feb 10, 2020 3:20 pm
by Shanahan
Lynx wrote: ↑Mon Feb 10, 2020 9:32 am
I remember that when RoH/NWA thing fell apart last year they were building towards Aldis/PCO match for Summerslam weekend show. It wasn't announced, but I remember reading somewhere that this was what they had in mind. So to me it looks like they are going back to that and it will build towards Aldis/Marty II.
Only good thing here is that PCO probably is dropping the title back to Rush at Anniversary show. Ideally PCO/Aldis will be in undercard, but it will probably be, unfortunately, one of the main matches.
I hope everything you said is correct. I like pco in tags or 6 men matches but 1 more singles match where he drops belt and we can move forward.
Re: Free Enterprise Official Thread
Posted: Mon Feb 10, 2020 3:33 pm
by AnHonorableMention
Shanahan wrote: ↑Mon Feb 10, 2020 2:02 pm
AnHonorableMention wrote: ↑Mon Feb 10, 2020 10:16 am
AlexROH wrote: ↑Mon Feb 10, 2020 12:31 am
Sorry for enjoying things. I forgot that I should be an angry man who is 24/7 remembering how good a company was 10 years ago and how shitty is right now because it isn't as fantastic as it used to be lol.
And if you think I havent watch old stuff or something like that. I've watch every single ROH year and have plenty of old DVDs, if what you were trying to say is that I'm just giving these ratings because i havent watch ROH Golden Era.
Yo dude, chill out, no need to jump down my throat for not seeing what you're seeing. Does the term generous insult you? Christ. But yeah you overrated a lot of those if not all of those matches from the vantage point of most people. I'm not angry either dude, I just happened to find better quality wrestling elsewhere that entertains me. Remember wrestling is infinite. Your ratings weren't wrong but man they definitely tell me you are very kind with what you dig. Chill out.
You complaining about people jumping down your throat? HAHAHAHA. Every single time anyone says anything positive about ROH you race on here to call them a shill. You passive aggressively called his ratings shit and when he calls you out for always being negative you play the victim....this gimmick is getting old.
Calling something generous is not insulting. Let the man speak for himself.
Re: Free Enterprise Official Thread
Posted: Mon Feb 10, 2020 3:35 pm
by AnHonorableMention
Lynx wrote: ↑Mon Feb 10, 2020 2:17 pm
It is ok not to like current RoH, but this desire to throw jabs at anyone who still likes it is weird.
I like a lot of the current ROH in fact in this very thread I praised the bones of the show. The only one I’ve called a shill is the Chrisvegas guy. Solely because he does not cite sources and pulls stuff out of thin air while asking questions of people in the know(IE me) to get stuff to post.
Re: Free Enterprise Official Thread
Posted: Tue Feb 11, 2020 1:34 am
by jhtrewin
First ROH show I've watched in a while, on the whole I liked the show.
Really loved the opener. Always been a fan of Shelley's work, I'm still holding out hope he will get a decent singles run as I feel he can do so much more. My hope is for him to take the Pure Title for a period.
It's a little sad to see Castle now, he just isn't what he used to be. Those injuries must of really done a number on him.
As everyone else has mentioned he Briscoes vs Mexisquad tag match was just fun to watch, as was the Maff/Cobb vs Lethal/Gresham tag.
I thought Slex looked pretty solid and looking forward to seeing him do more with the company.
The main event was decent. I struggle with PCO as the champion as I feel he is limited. I definitely think he makes a great team player in tag and multi-man matches here he can do his spots.
Re: Free Enterprise Official Thread
Posted: Tue Feb 11, 2020 8:00 am
by NewROHFan2020
famicommander wrote: ↑Sun Feb 09, 2020 7:24 pm
Neither PCO nor Aldis would rank in my top 50 workers if you laid out the entire rosters of ROH, NJPW, and NWA best to worst.
They're probably not in the top 100 if you added in CMLL and RevPro.
Neither of them belong in a singles match on a card as big as Supercard. These are guys you should try to hide because they're extremely limited in the ring.
I am more of a NWA fan than ROH, and at first I agreed with you. I didn’t care for Aldis being the champ, especially with such a long reign. I feel differently now and he’s such a great promo and I think he’s a good wrestler. He’s no Bandido or Dragon Lee, but he’s not the Bouncers either.
Re: Free Enterprise Official Thread
Posted: Tue Feb 11, 2020 10:37 am
by famicommander
Beer City Bruiser is way, way better than Aldis. Even when he does his cringey biting routine.
Aldis is garbage and the NWA is a garbage retirement home.
Re: Free Enterprise Official Thread
Posted: Tue Feb 11, 2020 10:50 am
by NewROHFan2020
famicommander wrote: ↑Tue Feb 11, 2020 10:37 am
Beer City Bruiser is way, way better than Aldis. Even when he does his cringey biting routine.
Aldis is garbage and the NWA is a garbage retirement home.
Doesn’t really say much about ROH then does it? Since they’re working with the NWA and their champion is 52 years old.
