Another excellent answer. Digging the feedback.famicommander wrote:ROH's talent drain and booking are ongoing areas of concern and for good reason. There are more big departures than arrivals in the last few years so naturally that's what people are going to talk about.maxx_powerz wrote:I suspect the question is rhetorical. But while there have been a lot more departures than signings the last year, I also think there is a lot more stressing over impending departures than celebrating possible new signings. Not sure if that is something particular to ROH fans because of generally negative feelings about the direction of the company or just human nature to worry about things that could happen. Probably both.
But there is also a tendency for fans to panic and/or pile on when wrestling companies appear to be struggling. Anyone who has ever been a TNA fan on the internet knows this well. That company has been a gong show and probably should have died multiple times by now, but I literally cannot remember a time when people online weren't talking about their impending doom. TNA has been about to die since about 4 days after it started.
It's pretty similar for every major promotion in the world except WWE, NJPW and CMLL. NOAH, AAA, DG, Lucha Underground, AJPW, etc. I'm not trying to downplay the financial struggles of any of those companies, nor TNA or ROH. But I must have read 500 news stories and 50,000 forum posts saying that one of those companies was due to die any day, and they're all still here.
You rarely see a headline on the wrestling news sites that says, "[insert promotion here] is pretty much operating as normal". They're either the next big thing or they're on their death bed.
ALL PURPOSE CONTRACT STATUS/POTENTIAL DEPARTURES THREAD
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Re: ALL PURPOSE CONTRACT STATUS/POTENTIAL DEPARTURES THREAD
Re: ALL PURPOSE CONTRACT STATUS/POTENTIAL DEPARTURES THREAD
Maxx....from what I heard while in the same circles with a few folks "in the know", it will be a one shot deal.....maxx_powerz wrote:You mentioned in the NJPW thread that their relationship with ROH looks to be on its last legs and we know Omega has a lukewarm relationship with ROH. I'd love to see Kenny get an extended run like AJ's 2014 / 2015, but it feels like wishful thinking.Brada wrote:If what I heard was true, Cole will get his Bullet Club exit on the way out the door from the Cleaner.
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Re: ALL PURPOSE CONTRACT STATUS/POTENTIAL DEPARTURES THREAD
i think omega status at this point with roh is good...i hope he returns soon,he is the natural replacement for cole,they need to do it before he wins the iwgp title
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Re: ALL PURPOSE CONTRACT STATUS/POTENTIAL DEPARTURES THREAD
There is also a real lack of buzzworthy incoming talent. Gresham might have been newly signed, but he's been around not doing much for about a year (remember the feud with Cedric last winter that went nowhere?). When they do bring new talent in, the new talent either isn't very good and/or isn't given a chance to show how good they are.maxx_powerz wrote:I suspect the question is rhetorical. But while there have been a lot more departures than signings the last year, I also think there is a lot more stressing over impending departures than celebrating possible new signings. Not sure if that is something particular to ROH fans because of generally negative feelings about the direction of the company or just human nature to worry about things that could happen. Probably both.
Re: ALL PURPOSE CONTRACT STATUS/POTENTIAL DEPARTURES THREAD
So if that's the case with the 90 days then does that mean Kyle O'Reilly would now be in the clear to sign with WWE?Brada wrote:Fish, Cole, any other potential Full Sail participant needs to be contract free for around 90 days before "the ball gets rolling"....
Re: ALL PURPOSE CONTRACT STATUS/POTENTIAL DEPARTURES THREAD
By causing delays for people in being able to sign with WWE they're now going to make it even harder for buzzworthy talent to consider ROH as an option if they have long term WWE goals.Big Red Machine wrote:There is also a real lack of buzzworthy incoming talent. Gresham might have been newly signed, but he's been around not doing much for about a year (remember the feud with Cedric last winter that went nowhere?). When they do bring new talent in, the new talent either isn't very good and/or isn't given a chance to show how good they are.maxx_powerz wrote:I suspect the question is rhetorical. But while there have been a lot more departures than signings the last year, I also think there is a lot more stressing over impending departures than celebrating possible new signings. Not sure if that is something particular to ROH fans because of generally negative feelings about the direction of the company or just human nature to worry about things that could happen. Probably both.
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Re: ALL PURPOSE CONTRACT STATUS/POTENTIAL DEPARTURES THREAD
Some people have come in and made immediate impacts recently in my opinion. Bully Ray, the Hardys, Vinny Marseglia, TK O'Ryan, Jay White, Marty Scurll, Will Ospreay, and Cody Rhodes being the biggest examples.Big Red Machine wrote: When they do bring new talent in, the new talent either isn't very good and/or isn't given a chance to show how good they are.
It's not been across the board, though. Punishment Martinez didn't need Kevin Sullivan at all. Lio Rush has been pretty aimless since winning TPT. None of the CMLL guys coming through really get involved in a storyline or feud.
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Re: ALL PURPOSE CONTRACT STATUS/POTENTIAL DEPARTURES THREAD
I agree, mostly. That said, if they do start a random Gresham push I don't think it's a big deal. Sydal, Edwards and Fish were all random spot fillers at one point too.Big Red Machine wrote:There is also a real lack of buzzworthy incoming talent. Gresham might have been newly signed, but he's been around not doing much for about a year (remember the feud with Cedric last winter that went nowhere?). When they do bring new talent in, the new talent either isn't very good and/or isn't given a chance to show how good they are.maxx_powerz wrote:I suspect the question is rhetorical. But while there have been a lot more departures than signings the last year, I also think there is a lot more stressing over impending departures than celebrating possible new signings. Not sure if that is something particular to ROH fans because of generally negative feelings about the direction of the company or just human nature to worry about things that could happen. Probably both.
When I talk about us liking to worry about departures more than celebrating signings, I kind of had Marty and Will in mind. The ink had barely dried on their contracts when we started worrying about them leaving. But in general, the quality of the departures has been much higher than the quality of the signings.
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Re: ALL PURPOSE CONTRACT STATUS/POTENTIAL DEPARTURES THREAD
Yeah, but just because they make impacts doesn't mean they are good. Marty, White and Ospreay are legit, but I'd prefer KOR, Roddy, ACH, Lio or Dijak over a Hardy's rental or any of the other new signings.famicommander wrote:Some people have come in and made immediate impacts recently in my opinion. Bully Ray, the Hardys, Vinny Marseglia, TK O'Ryan, Jay White, Marty Scurll, Will Ospreay, and Cody Rhodes being the biggest examples.Big Red Machine wrote: When they do bring new talent in, the new talent either isn't very good and/or isn't given a chance to show how good they are.
Re: ALL PURPOSE CONTRACT STATUS/POTENTIAL DEPARTURES THREAD
The thing with Ospreay and Scurll is that the booking of both those guys has done nothing to make you believe that they're here for long. Ospreay is barely there at all (four matches in 2017, including two in Japan at the Honor Rising shows) while Scurll is being fed random outside jobbers like Dutt and Robinson, and dudes on their way out like Dijak, Rush and Cole.maxx_powerz wrote:When I talk about us liking to worry about departures more than celebrating signings, I kind of had Marty and Will in mind. The ink had barely dried on their contracts when we started worrying about them leaving. But in general, the quality of the departures has been much higher than the quality of the signings.
http://thelone.be/ => My site, which means a bunch of random stuff really.
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Re: ALL PURPOSE CONTRACT STATUS/POTENTIAL DEPARTURES THREAD
This is what I thought when I posted the question originally.maxx_powerz wrote:But in general, the quality of the departures has been much higher than the quality of the signings.
Re: ALL PURPOSE CONTRACT STATUS/POTENTIAL DEPARTURES THREAD
What is your basis for saying this?monster mafia wrote:i think omega status at this point with roh is good...i hope he returns soon,he is the natural replacement for cole,they need to do it before he wins the iwgp title
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Re: ALL PURPOSE CONTRACT STATUS/POTENTIAL DEPARTURES THREAD
Interesting. I wonder if Cole and / or Omega are pushing for the match more than ROH is. Obviously we know ROH isn't above bringing someone in for a minute of buzz like with the Hardy's but there doesn't seem like much of a point for a single shot.Brada wrote:Maxx....from what I heard while in the same circles with a few folks "in the know", it will be a one shot deal.....maxx_powerz wrote:You mentioned in the NJPW thread that their relationship with ROH looks to be on its last legs and we know Omega has a lukewarm relationship with ROH. I'd love to see Kenny get an extended run like AJ's 2014 / 2015, but it feels like wishful thinking.Brada wrote:If what I heard was true, Cole will get his Bullet Club exit on the way out the door from the Cleaner.
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Re: ALL PURPOSE CONTRACT STATUS/POTENTIAL DEPARTURES THREAD
the same basis that you had about roh not making the uk tour last year...rovert wrote:What is your basis for saying this?monster mafia wrote:i think omega status at this point with roh is good...i hope he returns soon,he is the natural replacement for cole,they need to do it before he wins the iwgp title
i put "i think"..just a perception..
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Re: ALL PURPOSE CONTRACT STATUS/POTENTIAL DEPARTURES THREAD
I didn't have a problem with the Hardys coming in or a feud with the Bucks, but I hated the idea of them winning the titles just to put the titles on them for a short reign.maxx_powerz wrote:Yeah, but just because they make impacts doesn't mean they are good. Marty, White and Ospreay are legit, but I'd prefer KOR, Roddy, ACH, Lio or Dijak over a Hardy's rental or any of the other new signings.famicommander wrote:Some people have come in and made immediate impacts recently in my opinion. Bully Ray, the Hardys, Vinny Marseglia, TK O'Ryan, Jay White, Marty Scurll, Will Ospreay, and Cody Rhodes being the biggest examples.Big Red Machine wrote: When they do bring new talent in, the new talent either isn't very good and/or isn't given a chance to show how good they are.
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Re: ALL PURPOSE CONTRACT STATUS/POTENTIAL DEPARTURES THREAD
ODonnell wrote:If anyone wants to hear what it sounds like when ROH blocks you from going to WWE, listen to John Pollocks interview with Dijak on the Law this week. After speaking perfectly for every question, he couldn't stop stammering and pausing when asked about the next few months saying everything was up in the air, and hopefully he would have exciting opportunities soon.
Re: ALL PURPOSE CONTRACT STATUS/POTENTIAL DEPARTURES THREAD
Thoughts supersonic?
Re: ALL PURPOSE CONTRACT STATUS/POTENTIAL DEPARTURES THREAD
Well, I'm finally understood why ROH didn't push ACH to the moon, as a lot of people wish. Since he left ROH, and he's able to wrestle "in his own way" with freedom and all of that, he's being in a lower level. He had a great debut match at EVOLVE with Matt Riddle, ever since, all his matches has been getting worse. He tries to wrestle like he is a technical wizard or something like that, and he isn't. He is a great high-flyer and he should wrestle in his formula/style.
His best singles matches have been against Joe (Conquest Tour 2015) and Naito (WotW NYC 2016). He should wrestle the way people connect with him, and not in the way he thinks is better. His matches with Dunne and ZSJ during WM Week are a great example of this. He tries to overwrestle Thatcher, Dunne and ZSJ and you can see how he's unable to had an awesome match when he tries technical stuff.
I'm not going to say that I'm having with him leaving ROH; bc in ROH he had a great formula/style and always entertained me with his matches. But now I see one of the reasons why he wasn't getting a big main event push.
His best singles matches have been against Joe (Conquest Tour 2015) and Naito (WotW NYC 2016). He should wrestle the way people connect with him, and not in the way he thinks is better. His matches with Dunne and ZSJ during WM Week are a great example of this. He tries to overwrestle Thatcher, Dunne and ZSJ and you can see how he's unable to had an awesome match when he tries technical stuff.
I'm not going to say that I'm having with him leaving ROH; bc in ROH he had a great formula/style and always entertained me with his matches. But now I see one of the reasons why he wasn't getting a big main event push.
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Re: ALL PURPOSE CONTRACT STATUS/POTENTIAL DEPARTURES THREAD
Right on the money, Alex. ACH when given the freedom to do what he wants in a match, has no clue how to showcase his strengths and minimize his weaknesses. Your two examples of his best matches in ROH were with a HOFer in Samoa Joe, and a brilliant wrestling mind in Naito, who is an absolute genius in laying out a match. ACH won't do shit in Evolve which is why I didn't give a fuck when he left. PWG doesn't seem to be to motivated to bring him back either. Lio Rush on the other hand, was the complete opposite of this and I still think if you had to have one token high flyer on the roster, he was the guy.AlexROH wrote:Well, I'm finally understood why ROH didn't push ACH to the moon, as a lot of people wish. Since he left ROH, and he's able to wrestle "in his own way" with freedom and all of that, he's being in a lower level. He had a great debut match at EVOLVE with Matt Riddle, ever since, all his matches has been getting worse. He tries to wrestle like he is a technical wizard or something like that, and he isn't. He is a great high-flyer and he should wrestle in his formula/style.
His best singles matches have been against Joe (Conquest Tour 2015) and Naito (WotW NYC 2016). He should wrestle the way people connect with him, and not in the way he thinks is better. His matches with Dunne and ZSJ during WM Week are a great example of this. He tries to overwrestle Thatcher, Dunne and ZSJ and you can see how he's unable to had an awesome match when he tries technical stuff.
I'm not going to say that I'm having with him leaving ROH; bc in ROH he had a great formula/style and always entertained me with his matches. But now I see one of the reasons why he wasn't getting a big main event push.
Re: ALL PURPOSE CONTRACT STATUS/POTENTIAL DEPARTURES THREAD
ACH needs the Performance Center