ALL PURPOSE CONTRACT STATUS/POTENTIAL DEPARTURES THREAD

[Big Red Machine]

The ROH office will just simply bring in replacement talent . David Starr was just booked for Pittsburgh. I sure there will be more names announced in the near future.

But if the replacement talent isn't good enough and/or isn't used well (which has certainly been the trend over the past two years) then people will stop paying to show up.

[Memphis Mark]

The ROH office will just simply bring in replacement talent . David Starr was just booked for Pittsburgh. I sure there will be more names announced in the near future.

But if the replacement talent isn't good enough and/or isn't used well (which has certainly been the trend over the past two years) then people will stop paying to show up.

Valid points. If all that happens ROH will be sold/shuttered or the company will hire a new booker. It would appear that a dropout in business will be the only way to get booking and/or front office changes

[rovert]

The ROH office will just simply bring in replacement talent . David Starr was just booked for Pittsburgh. I sure there will be more names announced in the near future.

Or the will use him once and tell him to go a tryout camp.

[rovert]

As revealed on MLW Radio last night ROH is no longer using Kevin Sullivan. Personally I thought his stuff was the worst part of the recent product. BUT he was greatly liked and helpful towards the locker room. Sullivan was a political actor back in the day but now he's a 67 year old man who was just happy to get out of the house these days. But a paranoid Delirious and Koff felt he was too much of a threat so they axed him.

Meltzer will likely report it as they let him go as Corino left mid storyline. Much like the Truth Martini departure.

[monster mafia]

Kevin Sullivan out? good.

[JTCole]

Sullivan lives on an island in the middle of nowhere so it's not like he'd have been used much anyway.

[Brada]

So that storyline ended up being absolutely nothing. Go figure.

[AlexROH]

Yeahhh, Sullivan leaving is good news. Hope Whitmer and Punishment can be a good heel tag team without the stupid Corino/Sullivan storyline.

[Wilson]

As revealed on MLW Radio last night ROH is no longer using Kevin Sullivan. Personally I thought his stuff was the worst part of the recent product. BUT he was greatly liked and helpful towards the locker room. Sullivan was a political actor back in the day but now he's a 67 year old man who was just happy to get out of the house these days. But a paranoid Delirious and Koff felt he was too much of a threat so they axed him.

Meltzer will likely report it as they let him go as Corino left mid storyline. Much like the Truth Martini departure.

Questions regarding the lineaments of Delirious’s unknown face were asked all across the #HonorNation. The following is a composite sketch:

Spoiler: show

His termination will probably only serve the on-screen product but I have to imagine another talent leaving, and one with experience nearly unmatched, will be felt strangely by an already exhausted roster.

Is there any status on Nana? Was he very quietly let go? He had to have been next in this brutal queue of prophylactic terminations.

[AlexROH]

I'm watching Undisputed Legacy (I'll write a review in a couple of hours) and I feel sad when I see the talent involved in the show. I mean, there's a lot of guys that aren't under contract:

- Jonathan Gresham doesn't have a contract
- Jay White and The Tempura Boyz are on excursion.
- Jax Dane and Cody only work some dates
- Keith Lee and Donovan Dijak have already left the company
- Cole will propably leave in May
- Lio Rush doesn't have a contract and a lot of rumors say he's leaving after the Aniversary

[Buzz Sawyer]

As revealed on MLW Radio last night ROH is no longer using Kevin Sullivan. Personally I thought his stuff was the worst part of the recent product. BUT he was greatly liked and helpful towards the locker room. Sullivan was a political actor back in the day but now he's a 67 year old man who was just happy to get out of the house these days. But a paranoid Delirious and Koff felt he was too much of a threat so they axed him.

Meltzer will likely report it as they let him go as Corino left mid storyline. Much like the Truth Martini departure.

I enjoyed watch Nevik on my TV every few weeks.

[Buzz Sawyer]

I'm watching Undisputed Legacy (I'll write a review in a couple of hours) and I feel sad when I see the talent involved in the show. I mean, there's a lot of guys that aren't under contract:

- Jonathan Gresham doesn't have a contract
- Jay White and The Tempura Boyz are on excursion.
- Jax Dane and Cody only work some dates
- Keith Lee and Donovan Dijak have already left the company
- Cole will propably leave in May
- Lio Rush doesn't have a contract and a lot of rumors say he's leaving after the Aniversary

Gresham should be signed.
When are White/Tempura Boyz going back to NJPW?

[BrandenScott]

The ROH office will just simply bring in replacement talent . David Starr was just booked for Pittsburgh. I sure there will be more names announced in the near future.

But if the replacement talent isn't good enough and/or isn't used well (which has certainly been the trend over the past two years) then people will stop paying to show up.

Valid points. If all that happens ROH will be sold/shuttered or the company will hire a new booker. It would appear that a dropout in business will be the only way to get booking and/or front office changes

David Starr will not be in Pittsburgh. He is working Matt Riddle for CZW. He tweeted me to confirm he will not be at ROH

[TYFDK]

Think he meant Columbus.

[BurningHammer]

David Starr will not be in Pittsburgh. He is working Matt Riddle for CZW. He tweeted me to confirm he will not be at ROH

He is booked for the show on Sunday not Saturday which is why he said he wont be there.

[AlexROH]

Thedonsutd from Reddit transcripted the Bauer interview. He said some interesting things:

MSL: "Something that I saw this week that I paid extra attention to because it involved broadcasters and I am a broadcaster myself, is the story that Kevin Kelly, who was working full-time for Ring of Honor has left and will instead be doing part-time shows and New Japan. I've seen a lot of memes online comparing ROH to HBO show The Wire, because their both based in Baltimore and there is always drama going on behind-the-scenes..."
Court: "They both have big body counts to match!"
MSL: "...haha. Have you any insight on this Court?"
Court: "Ah yeah, Kevin Kelly who was also doing broadcasting duties for New Japan through their New Japan World service, ah... basically gave notice he was leaving, ehm, I understand he was basically given an ultimatum and eh, it's a peculiar situation, I mean there's just a lot of instability with Sinclair Broadcasting's [ROH's parent company] management of their Ring of Honor division, a lot of guys are moving on, a lot of guys are leaving, and... eh, they just reach a point where they leave - and I'm not speaking for Kevin Kelly in particular, there's just... a lot of people that have left and have gone to EVOLVE and have gone to... end up being signed by WWE and have gone to... just move on to other things and... that's not a great narrative to have for your company when the only big stories coming out from your company are these kinds of things.
This is a company that really was supposed to be all about wrestling and not about drama, in the way it was originally envisioned when it was launched in 2002 and you don't really hear people talking about the great wrestling anymore, you hear people talking about... what's the deal with them sticking with one booker and not just moving on to other guys, or what's the deal with this guy leaving or that guy leaving. Joe Koff overseas the division [ROH] as the COO from within Sinclair along with the booker, Delirious, and he and Delirious have a father/son relationship, that is... essentially unbreakable. Its been tested, its been challenged and it has prevailed, some have tried to divide, some have tried to politically divide and all have failed... and all will fail if they try to do that or their perceived as a threat. Look, the reality is-"
MSL: "Well, I heard rumors online - I don't know if this is true, but I read these rumors online - that Kevin Kelly wanted Delirious' job. I don't know if that played any role in his departure or not?"
Court: "Well you know, there's just so much paranoia from certain people within Ring of Honor about that, whether it's real or not. If you're really good at your job, you shouldn't sweat that, but it seems that like... look - I don't want to put you in an awkward situation M so, we can edit this out after if you like but... I understand, that they have not booked Kevin Sullivan since December because internally he was perceived as a threat, and that there aren't any plans to book him, ah, which is a shame because if you talk to fans who were watching the product they liked Kevin Sullivan on their show on a weekly basis and I understand the boys liked him as he was giving them great feedback on their matched and how they could get better, as a veteran with a gazillion decades of knowledge would do and that's a benefit. And you know, there were insecurities - "
At this point, Court audibly becomes more angry when speaking, actually cutting MSL off completely.
Court: "I mean, a guy at 69/70-years-old isn't going to take the fucking book and fucking book, y'know, wherever in Pennsylvania shows, so it's like what are you threatened by?"
MSL: "...Ehm, I hadn't heard that - it wouldn't shock me just because I know how wrestling is, and sometimes that sucks for guys like Kevin, who has all this knowledge -"
Court: "It's fucking absurd! It's fucking absurd! And the fact that Joe Koff, the COO of this thing, just allows this operation to become so toxic and dysfunctional is just asinine to me! There is no oversight above that, there is nobody from Sinclair looking out - whether it's a wrestling mind or not - but it's not helping the product. The preservation or the self-preservation that's going on there is detrimental to the brand, its detrimental to the talent, its detrimental to the fans, its detrimental to the viewers and to the company's future! It's ridiculous.
And Joe [Koff] is in his late 60's, eventually he will pass the baton on to Greg Gilliland. Greg Gilliland [general manager of Ring of Honor for Sinclair] runs the day-to-day operations, and, eh, maybe then it will change, but right now... not so much. And it's so sad to see something compromised due to the insecurities to the extent it has. It really is sad."
MSL: "Well it wouldn't shock me because I know how wrestling works. And you know, from Kevin's side, when he started doing appearances for them he was just happy to be working for them, he was just happy to be involved, I mean - hahaha there wasn't any mind-set at this stage of his life of him wanting to be a booker anymore or anything like that so. So that's unfortunate if that's the case."
Court: "Look, it's the same thing, Gary Hart, dear friend of Kevin Sullivan's, when he started doing these autograph sessions when he was in his late 60's it was just to get out of the house, he was just happy to get out of the house and make a payday, for Kevin Sullivan it was just to get out of the house and make a payday. Neither of these guys at this point in their lives have the interest to book or write TV every week or edit it in post-production in Baltimore - that's just not their lifestyle anymore, and of course if you see someone with that wealth of talent and experience and of course he [Kevin Sullivan] goes back 30/40 years with Joe Koff because Kevin first met him through Florida, then they [Delirious] are like, "uh-oh", they view that as a potential threat to the throne, and it's just pathetic. I don't know what else to say."
MSL: "Well man, I hope it's not true because I know the fans love seeing Kevin and he loves seeing them too so, I just hope it's not true."

[FanSinceHDNet]

Counterpoints to the Sullivan thing:

BJ Whitmer went from nuclear heat to a bit neutered following Sullivan's involvement.

In many reviews, Sullivan's involvement is the part that takes away from the otherwise pretty awesome Fight Without Honor.

Many fans on here began the running joke of "this feud will never end". And television reviews indicate that the Sullivan's involvement wasn't either fully understood or explained in a way that made sense.

Finally, Corino is gone. Let's assume Corino had something to do with Sullivan getting booked. Let's say Sullivan was getting booked at $500 to $1,000 plus trans per show (remote island in Washington, Seattle flights aren't cheap...).

Even stripping away the critical indifference to the angle, don't you think the logic of saving anywhere between $1000 and $1500 per show after an angle had run its course on television outweighs the minor shine he gives to Martinez?

[AlexROH]

I don't think Bauer is right with the Sullivan thing. However, the point about Koff/Johnson is interesting. I think that's the main problem now in ROH:

"Joe Koff overseas the division [ROH] as the COO from within Sinclair along with the booker, Delirious, and he and Delirious have a father/son relationship, that is... essentially unbreakable. Its been tested, its been challenged and it has prevailed, some have tried to divide, some have tried to politically divide and all have failed... and all will fail if they try to do that or their perceived as a threat. Look, the reality is-""

[Thelone]

The issue with the Corino/Whitmer feud of doom is more about how it went through like fifty different phases and none of those went anywhere.

First it was just Whitmer being an asshole to Corino because of old history between them (like Whitmer having a fling with Allison Danger years ago) and I guess more recently SCUM, then Whitmer enrolled Colby in the Decade to play MINDGAMES with Corino, then Page turned on Whitmer for little to no reason (supposedly being abandonned by Whitmer who was more busy fucking around with Corino and his son), then a wild Sullivan randomly appeared out of nowhere because EVIL, then Whitmer joined him to kill his heat I guess and Corino became Booze McGee or whatever, then it became some random ass stuff about Dusty Rhodes and Cody and I guess it's just dead now after that mountain of garbage.

[DXvsNWO1994]

Thedonsutd from Reddit transcripted the Bauer interview. He said some interesting things:

MSL: "Something that I saw this week that I paid extra attention to because it involved broadcasters and I am a broadcaster myself, is the story that Kevin Kelly, who was working full-time for Ring of Honor has left and will instead be doing part-time shows and New Japan. I've seen a lot of memes online comparing ROH to HBO show The Wire, because their both based in Baltimore and there is always drama going on behind-the-scenes..."
Court: "They both have big body counts to match!"
MSL: "...haha. Have you any insight on this Court?"
Court: "Ah yeah, Kevin Kelly who was also doing broadcasting duties for New Japan through their New Japan World service, ah... basically gave notice he was leaving, ehm, I understand he was basically given an ultimatum and eh, it's a peculiar situation, I mean there's just a lot of instability with Sinclair Broadcasting's [ROH's parent company] management of their Ring of Honor division, a lot of guys are moving on, a lot of guys are leaving, and... eh, they just reach a point where they leave - and I'm not speaking for Kevin Kelly in particular, there's just... a lot of people that have left and have gone to EVOLVE and have gone to... end up being signed by WWE and have gone to... just move on to other things and... that's not a great narrative to have for your company when the only big stories coming out from your company are these kinds of things.
This is a company that really was supposed to be all about wrestling and not about drama, in the way it was originally envisioned when it was launched in 2002 and you don't really hear people talking about the great wrestling anymore, you hear people talking about... what's the deal with them sticking with one booker and not just moving on to other guys, or what's the deal with this guy leaving or that guy leaving. Joe Koff overseas the division [ROH] as the COO from within Sinclair along with the booker, Delirious, and he and Delirious have a father/son relationship, that is... essentially unbreakable. Its been tested, its been challenged and it has prevailed, some have tried to divide, some have tried to politically divide and all have failed... and all will fail if they try to do that or their perceived as a threat. Look, the reality is-"
MSL: "Well, I heard rumors online - I don't know if this is true, but I read these rumors online - that Kevin Kelly wanted Delirious' job. I don't know if that played any role in his departure or not?"
Court: "Well you know, there's just so much paranoia from certain people within Ring of Honor about that, whether it's real or not. If you're really good at your job, you shouldn't sweat that, but it seems that like... look - I don't want to put you in an awkward situation M so, we can edit this out after if you like but... I understand, that they have not booked Kevin Sullivan since December because internally he was perceived as a threat, and that there aren't any plans to book him, ah, which is a shame because if you talk to fans who were watching the product they liked Kevin Sullivan on their show on a weekly basis and I understand the boys liked him as he was giving them great feedback on their matched and how they could get better, as a veteran with a gazillion decades of knowledge would do and that's a benefit. And you know, there were insecurities - "
At this point, Court audibly becomes more angry when speaking, actually cutting MSL off completely.
Court: "I mean, a guy at 69/70-years-old isn't going to take the fucking book and fucking book, y'know, wherever in Pennsylvania shows, so it's like what are you threatened by?"
MSL: "...Ehm, I hadn't heard that - it wouldn't shock me just because I know how wrestling is, and sometimes that sucks for guys like Kevin, who has all this knowledge -"
Court: "It's fucking absurd! It's fucking absurd! And the fact that Joe Koff, the COO of this thing, just allows this operation to become so toxic and dysfunctional is just asinine to me! There is no oversight above that, there is nobody from Sinclair looking out - whether it's a wrestling mind or not - but it's not helping the product. The preservation or the self-preservation that's going on there is detrimental to the brand, its detrimental to the talent, its detrimental to the fans, its detrimental to the viewers and to the company's future! It's ridiculous.
And Joe [Koff] is in his late 60's, eventually he will pass the baton on to Greg Gilliland. Greg Gilliland [general manager of Ring of Honor for Sinclair] runs the day-to-day operations, and, eh, maybe then it will change, but right now... not so much. And it's so sad to see something compromised due to the insecurities to the extent it has. It really is sad."
MSL: "Well it wouldn't shock me because I know how wrestling works. And you know, from Kevin's side, when he started doing appearances for them he was just happy to be working for them, he was just happy to be involved, I mean - hahaha there wasn't any mind-set at this stage of his life of him wanting to be a booker anymore or anything like that so. So that's unfortunate if that's the case."
Court: "Look, it's the same thing, Gary Hart, dear friend of Kevin Sullivan's, when he started doing these autograph sessions when he was in his late 60's it was just to get out of the house, he was just happy to get out of the house and make a payday, for Kevin Sullivan it was just to get out of the house and make a payday. Neither of these guys at this point in their lives have the interest to book or write TV every week or edit it in post-production in Baltimore - that's just not their lifestyle anymore, and of course if you see someone with that wealth of talent and experience and of course he [Kevin Sullivan] goes back 30/40 years with Joe Koff because Kevin first met him through Florida, then they [Delirious] are like, "uh-oh", they view that as a potential threat to the throne, and it's just pathetic. I don't know what else to say."
MSL: "Well man, I hope it's not true because I know the fans love seeing Kevin and he loves seeing them too so, I just hope it's not true."

I'm really glad this got shared here (I was planning on posting it myself, if it wasn't posted already). It seems like nothing is going to change unless Joe Koff gets ousted.