ALL PURPOSE CONTRACT STATUS/POTENTIAL DEPARTURES THREAD

This is the place to discuss all the latest ROH news, announcements and events!
HonorLives
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Re: ALL PURPOSE CONTRACT STATUS/POTENTIAL DEPARTURES THREAD

Post by HonorLives »

leenie426 wrote:Larry Legend - was fired from his warehouse / ROH Pro Shop gig aka full time employment. Bringing him back as talking microphone for local events has no heath coverage.
This topic is so sad.
monster mafia
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Re: ALL PURPOSE CONTRACT STATUS/POTENTIAL DEPARTURES THREAD

Post by monster mafia »

kamaitachi cuts a promo and talks about roh world championship and adam cole, so maye he is not finished with roh.
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supersonic
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Re: ALL PURPOSE CONTRACT STATUS/POTENTIAL DEPARTURES THREAD

Post by supersonic »

Observer:
It’s going to be very interesting because most of the key players in the promotion are under one-year contracts that would expire at or around 12/31, including The Young Bucks, Bobby Fish, Kyle O’Reilly, Jay Lethal, Ray Rowe, Hanson, Kenny King, Steve Corino and B.J. Whitmer. The question becomes which on those list would have viable alternatives. It’s a weird situation because of the New Japan relationship. Some of the talent likes the ROH/New Japan mix because they get the Japanese bookings, although Michael Elgin for one has a New Japan contract and works ROH between tours and through New Japan, while the names on the aforementioned list work New Japan through ROH. Nobody knows how much of a factor TNA would be, particularly since the one person in TNA most knowledgeable about ROH and who pushed to sign ROH guys, David Lagana (who used to work for ROH), is no longer with TNA. At least some would be good additions for NXT, but the question is would WWE pay the same or more of what key guys make in ROH and New Japan combined, plus there is far more freedom in these companies to do what you want and wrestle how you want than there would be in WWE. Of course, if you hit it big in WWE, like many former ROH guys like Owens, Zayn and Rollins, you’re in a completely different stratosphere, but NXT contracts are generally the same or substantially less than the key ROH deals, depending on the person, and that’s not even figuring the New Japan money and the merchandise money (since ROH talent keep a far higher percentage of merchandise money than WWE talent does, although obviously if you’re pushed on WWE television, the difference makes that merch money night and day in favor of WWE). However, anyone of the names on this list, if WWE truly wants them, they can get them because they can afford to pay much more if they want them, and WWE will constantly need new real talent for its NXT tours when the current headliners move up
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Wilson
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Re: ALL PURPOSE CONTRACT STATUS/POTENTIAL DEPARTURES THREAD

Post by Wilson »

supersonic wrote:Observer:
It’s going to be very interesting because most of the key players in the promotion are under one-year contracts that would expire at or around 12/31, including The Young Bucks, Bobby Fish, Kyle O’Reilly, Jay Lethal, Ray Rowe, Hanson, Kenny King, Steve Corino and B.J. Whitmer.
That’s a whole mess of talent. I really don’t expect all of them to resign.

In terms of the current narrative of the product, Kyle O’Reilly is obviously the biggest contingency. Given the timing, his leave would probably be of the largest missteps in company history.

If ROH is going to structure their contract schedule by the calendar year, it would benefit them to make Best in the World their flagship PPV. Having all these contracts looming over Final Battle is preposterous.
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Re: ALL PURPOSE CONTRACT STATUS/POTENTIAL DEPARTURES THREAD

Post by 187_Joeism »

if WWE truly wants them, they can get them because they can afford to pay much more if they want them

This is the key part some people still do not understand
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leenie426
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Re: ALL PURPOSE CONTRACT STATUS/POTENTIAL DEPARTURES THREAD

Post by leenie426 »

Wilson wrote:
supersonic wrote:Observer:
It’s going to be very interesting because most of the key players in the promotion are under one-year contracts that would expire at or around 12/31, including The Young Bucks, Bobby Fish, Kyle O’Reilly, Jay Lethal, Ray Rowe, Hanson, Kenny King, Steve Corino and B.J. Whitmer.
That’s a whole mess of talent. I really don’t expect all of them to resign.

In terms of the current narrative of the product, Kyle O’Reilly is obviously the biggest contingency. Given the timing, his leave would probably be of the largest missteps in company history.

If ROH is going to structure their contract schedule by the calendar year, it would benefit them to make Best in the World their flagship PPV. Having all these contracts looming over Final Battle is preposterous.
ROH is in the same spot New Japan was a year ago when their top talent is all up at the same time

- Fish
- O'Reilly
- Lethal
- Cole *extended to April because of injury
- Briscoes (Feb/March)
- Young Bucks
- Steve Corino *At the WWE PC this week
- War Machine *apparently the Office Boy isn't high on them
- Lio Rush (March)
- BJ Whitmer

With all of these guys being up it means ROH is going to have to come up with a lot on money, something that they haven't been willing to do, so who do you go after first and who do you hope is still around when all your first priorities are signed?

The Briscoes have been there since day one... how many more times can they win the tag titles? how many more times can they give jay the belt? should they give mark a run with the title, if for nothing else he is an unsung hero in the company? Stupid twitter comments aside, let's face it we have just elected a man who makes what Jay Briscoe tweeted look like nursery rhymes, is it time for the Briscoes to move on?

Have War Machine been wasted? The won the titles and then we've never really heard from them. They have almost no tv talk time. They are going into New Japan's biggest tournament of the year on a losing streak... why? Sometimes I really have to scratch my head at Johnston's booking or real lack of thought that he puts into it.

Speaking of booking is it time to shake things up? We are going on 5 years now of one guy, and his creativity has run out.
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Re: ALL PURPOSE CONTRACT STATUS/POTENTIAL DEPARTURES THREAD

Post by The Dragon Saga »

Lets run through the names quickly and seriously consider where these guys can go.

- Bobby Fish; 40-years-old - yeah, if you didn't know, hes been around for quite a while. He was considered old when he joined ROH and that was what, four years ago now? He's the World TV Champion, gets plenty of time to talk, is probably making good money between ROH and New Japan and so long as he stays with ROH will consistently be booked in New Japan, with or without O'Reilly, however he means more $$$ for me as one-half of arguably the best in-ring tag team of the last few years.

- Kyle O'Reilly; so where exactly is he supposed to be headed then? New Japan? Why would he limit himself to just New Japan? Even if he does put on the weight, will be really have a chance in the heavyweight division? Sure he's a phenomenal wrestler but he still hasn't achieved "It" yet and he's still not "there" either. For me, if its on the table, him rejecting a ROH World Championship run would be the stupidest thing he could do. Take the run, see how it's handled and then in a year survey the landscape again. There's no indication WWE is interested in him right now and while I'm sure Richards has told him TNA would be great for him, Davey's hanging it up next year and TNA is obviously in tatters.

- Jay Lethal; Lethal is the one who I think has the most potential. He'd be the guy who'd walk into NXT, ala Nakamura, and just be in the main event from the get go. They can talk about how hes wrestled in the Tokyo Dome in-front of 30,000 people, Corey Graves can reiterate how he's, "the biggest free agent available today" and all that jazz and I'm sure WWE would be interested. Jay is 31-years-old, hes done it all, he is for me the face of the promotion but at the end of the day, if WWE is the next step that's fine, let him leave.

- Adam Cole; if WWE want him, at this point, like Lethal, hes pretty much done it all. In his second ROH World title reign, leader of the US version of the Bullet Club, he has the look, he can talk, he'll probably need to work on his physique a little bit but that's what the Performance Center is for. He would be a big loss because of his appeal and popularity but again, hes been with ROH now seven years, hes done it all, if it's time to go it's time to go.

- The Briscoes; as the above poster stated and as we were stating LAST YEAR when the rumors started up about The Briscoes, they have literally done everything. Mark needs a singles title reign and that's it, but need is hyperbole on my part because he doesn't necessarily need it. How many more promos will they cut about being here since day one? How many more feuds can they have about how people need to respect their legacies? How many more times do they need to win the ROH World Tag Team Championships? Does Jay really need to be the first time three time ROH World Champion? The Briscoes have done it all and then some and more! If they stay, Mark needs a singles title reign, but if they leave, they leave, they'd be a loss because of what they mean to ROH but it's not like they won't have done something.

Note: The Briscoes outside of wrestling have quite a successful gardening and landscaping business. While some may giggle at that they have always seemed very passionate about not throwing that away just for wrestling so if they go to NXT that's essentially bye bye to their outside business plus they'll need to move to Florida unless like Gallows & Anderson they get a straight up main roster run.

- Young Bucks; they seem to get off not needing WWE more than WWE really seem to want them, is the impression I always get. They haven't got much more they can do outside of WWE to be honest, they've won pretty much all the tag belts, they need the IWGP Tag Team titles but do they fit that mold? It totally depends on what they want to do. As Meltzer has said before they get a lot of money from ROH alone, the New Japan dates are the icing on that cake. If ROH can improve on that, sure, stay. If they can't, go to WWE, again not a lot left to do.

- Steve Corino; he'd be an awesome coach for them and if they want him as an announcer I for one would be happy for Corino to go. He's one of those guys that years ago deserved a WWE run and never got it. I know people are critical of his commentary but personally, for me, he's the best color commentator in the business - a business not full of very good color guys anymore. This is up in the air.

- War Machine; yeah, I don't see them leaving at all. Still lots to do, Hanson is in his late 30's and admits in Cabana's podcast that he has a lot of injuries, his goal was also to make it to Ring of Honor and to win the ROH World Championship. Ray Rowe was nothing before War Machine and like Fish, while don't mean as much, War Machine = more $$$ than Ray Rowe or Hanson equal as singles guys. I doubt their going anywhere and I doubt WWE are interested. They'll stick around and do the ROH/New Japan deal.

- Lio Rush; why in God's name would he leave? Apparently at wXw he cut a promo talking about how much he loved working for ROH and how he intends to reach the top there. He's young and I'm sure he'd fit in great in their cruiserweight division but does he really want to forgo more of a career than being stereotyped as a WWE cruiserweight? Again, doubt he's going anywhere, makes little sense for him to. He also has more potential for me than ACH did and seems to be a much smarter guy.

- BJ Whitmer; he's not going anywhere. He is heavily featured, apparently has a backstage role and has been with ROH forever. If anything he'll get more money which will help him and he probably has a job for life.

As for Delirious and whether creative gets shaken up or not, there are tons of elements to take into consideration. One being Delirious has been with ROH since Sinclair took over, he was Cornette's right hand man, Joe Koff talks about him like he's his son or some shit, hes handled personal issues well by bringing back several names who knocked him and ROH after they left which shows a very professional demeanor. Whether the rumors that he is hard to communicate with are true or not, anyone associated with ROH say he does the job of like six people. He only started getting help from others this past summer and if a small rumor making the rounds, that Christopher Daniels may take over if Delirious were to step aside, would Daniels be able to devote as much time to ROH as Delirious does? Delirious seems to be a company guy and I'm sure he gets paid well so he'll hold onto the booker job until someone axes him or he totally burns out. I doubt the former will happen so long as Koff is in charge.
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The Dragon Saga
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Re: ALL PURPOSE CONTRACT STATUS/POTENTIAL DEPARTURES THREAD

Post by The Dragon Saga »

And with all that said, if the guys who I believe may actually leave, which for me is potentially Jay Lethal, Adam Cole, The Briscoes and The Young Bucks, think about the amount of money that'll fee up for ROH to book what everyone seems to be screaming for, fresh talent! Then you have guys like Lio Rush, Punisher Martinez, potentially Jax Dane, Marty Scurll, Will Ospreay, Dalton Castle and others who they could bring in getting more chances because the stalwarts will all have left, even if they do leave.

For what it's worth, maybe some of them leaving wouldn't be the worst thing in the world. It could be a "new generation" of sorts for ROH. And you'd still experience in guys like Fish, O'Reilly, The Addiction, MCMG, Whitmer, etc.
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LJimmy
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Re: ALL PURPOSE CONTRACT STATUS/POTENTIAL DEPARTURES THREAD

Post by LJimmy »

I think New Japan will be the key in a lot of these contracts like it often seems to be. You gotta remember that the more recent ROH to WWE defectors like Cedric and Roddy were not getting New Japan bookings at the time of their departures.

As for how some would fare in WWE, I agree Cole and Lethal would do well. O'Reilly, not sure. I don't know if they need any more people who are best known for being good in the ring. I'm sure the Bucks would be over big in NXT, but I wonder how they would translate to the main roster.
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Re: ALL PURPOSE CONTRACT STATUS/POTENTIAL DEPARTURES THREAD

Post by project161 »

War Machine have been blundered pretty terribly for a while. Their tag title reign was undersold including their big win over the Briscoes which should have been marketed much more effectively than it was, let alone the follow up of them losing the belts 24 hours later. I know Rowe has been in Orlando a couple times recently, not that that means anything, but both could have had the spots that the Authors of Pain now have. Given if New Japan continues to book them after their upcoming stint there, it may prove more beneficial for them to stay.

Lethal and Cole both could easily end up in WWE at this point. Lethal particularly has very little left to prove in ROH and Cole is just about in the same boat. Kyle could easily end up in NXT at this point but I'm not sure of how successful he would be. I feel like he would end up in a similar spot to Biff Busick there in that they recognize that he is a good worker, but have no intention of pushing him above the lower/midcard area.

The Bucks seem to have peaked in popularity last year, not that they are not still riding off of it in 2016. At this point, if WWE were to make them an offer, it would be a now or never move in my opinion.
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Re: ALL PURPOSE CONTRACT STATUS/POTENTIAL DEPARTURES THREAD

Post by TYFDK »

Veda Scott's gone.
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Thelone
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Re: ALL PURPOSE CONTRACT STATUS/POTENTIAL DEPARTURES THREAD

Post by Thelone »

Good, never understood the hype around her.

As for the other guys mentioned :

- Fish : he's not going anywhere at his age, so ROH/NJPW or NJPW/ROH is the most likely.
- O'Reilly : he's been booked like shit for well over a year and seems to have more traction in New Japan than ROH. I guess both options are realistic, but I would pick NJPW/ROH if I was him, just because New Japan is much more high profile than ROH nowadays.
- Lethal : he's not going anywhere either. His overly long reign of terror was his "peak" and I can't imagine either NJPW picking him up after those mediocre matches or NXT because he's not an indy darling or a great wrestler.
- Cole : NXT.
- Briscoes : they seem to be doing fine with ROH/NJPW + whatever they're doing outside of wrestling, but I feel like seeing less of them for a year or so would be beneficial at this point.
- Young Bucks : hard to say really. I can't imagine ROH throwing more money at them if most of the talent was upset by that move a year ago, and WWE/NXT doesn't seem that obvious if you ask me. NJPW/ROH or back to freelance basically.
- Corino : don't care, dump him.
- War Machine : they've been mishandled so badly that I can't imagine them staying at this point. NJPW(/ROH) could be an option if they do well during the tag league, but the most likely scenario is going back to freelance.
- Lio Rush : nothing is clear in this case so I don't know.
- Whitmer : I can't imagine him leaving, but who knows.
http://thelone.be/ => My site, which means a bunch of random stuff really.
rohfan237
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Re: ALL PURPOSE CONTRACT STATUS/POTENTIAL DEPARTURES THREAD

Post by rohfan237 »

Saga, you are so out to lunch on like 80% of the stuff you said.
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Re: ALL PURPOSE CONTRACT STATUS/POTENTIAL DEPARTURES THREAD

Post by The Dragon Saga »

rohfan237 wrote:Saga, you are so out to lunch on like 80% of the stuff you said.
Fantastic response, way to intelligently dissect my post and provide some debate.

If I replied with "get fucked" it would have the same level of sense in response to your post as yours is to mine.
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christopherclinton55
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Re: ALL PURPOSE CONTRACT STATUS/POTENTIAL DEPARTURES THREAD

Post by christopherclinton55 »

Thelone wrote:Good, never understood the hype around her.

As for the other guys mentioned :

- Fish : he's not going anywhere at his age, so ROH/NJPW or NJPW/ROH is the most likely.
- O'Reilly : he's been booked like shit for well over a year and seems to have more traction in New Japan than ROH. I guess both options are realistic, but I would pick NJPW/ROH if I was him, just because New Japan is much more high profile than ROH nowadays.
- Lethal : he's not going anywhere either. His overly long reign of terror was his "peak" and I can't imagine either NJPW picking him up after those mediocre matches or NXT because he's not an indy darling or a great wrestler.
- Cole : NXT.
- Briscoes : they seem to be doing fine with ROH/NJPW + whatever they're doing outside of wrestling, but I feel like seeing less of them for a year or so would be beneficial at this point.
- Young Bucks : hard to say really. I can't imagine ROH throwing more money at them if most of the talent was upset by that move a year ago, and WWE/NXT doesn't seem that obvious if you ask me. NJPW/ROH or back to freelance basically.
- Corino : don't care, dump him.
- War Machine : they've been mishandled so badly that I can't imagine them staying at this point. NJPW(/ROH) could be an option if they do well during the tag league, but the most likely scenario is going back to freelance.
- Lio Rush : nothing is clear in this case so I don't know.
- Whitmer : I can't imagine him leaving, but who knows.
Stop it Lethal match wasn't even bad your personal grudge against him making you look foolish.
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Re: ALL PURPOSE CONTRACT STATUS/POTENTIAL DEPARTURES THREAD

Post by BurningHammer »

I think all could continue working with ROH after their contracts end but wether or not they all re-sign I doubt it. You also have to consider that there have also been contracts ending in October and September that still haven't been re-signed but are still working with ROH. Silas Young is a prime example of that, he actually had a real push and prevalent story line within ROH so as long as you can be trusted without a contract I think you'll be used well. which maybe the way we see things go for the time being, unless say you are in line for a title program.

Considering though WWE's now massive desire for everything Indy I don't think anyone is off limits or not under consideration like War Machine. I think a lot of guys would benefit from moving on, mainly because they have found it hard to recover from the bad booking before the last three months or so. There also a lot of guys heading into that age where If they have a chance they need to take it now else I doubt it will happen again, so we may see a new injection of young fresh talent or I hope so.

I think the important guys to keep obviously with story lines going into next year are obviously,

Fish and O'Reilly, I think if both stay not a lot changes booking wise and things can continue to make sense.

Young Bucks/Cole, I think are planned with the Kingdom or that seems to be the area ROH want's to take, so keeping them for say 6 months would be great as it wouldn't change too much again.

Lethal, is an interesting case as he has no real high profile story heading into Final Battle or out of it (unless he does get added to the main event) but I think keeping him to the roster just expands the quality ROH has and would lead to a better 2017 overall.

War Machine, already touched on.

Leo Rush, He isn't really involved anything to heavy so him leaving really does nothing to the overall product and their maybe younger guys that will be happy in his lesser role and achieve more overall.

Corino, Have more of a desire to see him leave as I think it would beneifit the product overall.

BJ, See Corino.
rohfan237
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Re: ALL PURPOSE CONTRACT STATUS/POTENTIAL DEPARTURES THREAD

Post by rohfan237 »

The Dragon Saga wrote:
rohfan237 wrote:Saga, you are so out to lunch on like 80% of the stuff you said.
Fantastic response, way to intelligently dissect my post and provide some debate.

If I replied with "get fucked" it would have the same level of sense in response to your post as yours is to mine.
ROH isn't worth the effort.

The best part of your post is where you act as if ROH isn't on TNA's level right now.

Get fucked.
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supersonic
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Re: ALL PURPOSE CONTRACT STATUS/POTENTIAL DEPARTURES THREAD

Post by supersonic »

ROH isn't on TNA's level. One makes profit via PPVs, tickets, touring, PPV, merchandise, and co-promotional relationships. The other does not. One largely stays publicly mum on offscreen matters. The other does not.

Please don't pollute my informative thread with shit that clearly isn't on the pulse.
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Re: ALL PURPOSE CONTRACT STATUS/POTENTIAL DEPARTURES THREAD

Post by rohfan237 »

You're right. ROH is below TNA.

supersonic, your online demise has been quite entertaining to follow. Please, continue.
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Re: ALL PURPOSE CONTRACT STATUS/POTENTIAL DEPARTURES THREAD

Post by supersonic »

Tossing you on the same list with the irrationally thin-skinned ROH defender.
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