ALL PURPOSE NEW TALENT/SPECIAL ATTRACTION THREAD

[187_Joeism]

The fact that they're finally looking beyond seminars is really encouraging.

Keith Lee, Shane Taylor, Jason Kincaid, Lio Rush, Jonathan Gresham, David Starr all went to the seminars, the narrative of "Oh they are only using talent from the seminars" was always bad because they had talent there, their problem is that they are not good at scouting talent. They passed on Matt Riddle, Biff Busick, Drew Gulak and other big names that went to the seminars.

[Big Red Machine]

The fact that they're finally looking beyond seminars is really encouraging.

They really aren't though. Kamaitachi and White are New Japan guys on excursion and we still don't know what the deal is with Ospreay and Scurll. The other guys you and others mentionned are very much seminar dudes.

But they are bringing in new talent. Sure they may not be pushed as best as they could right now, but bringing in Lio Rush, Kamaitachi, Jay White, Punisher Martinez, Shane Taylor, Keith Lee, maybe Jonathan Gresham, maybe Jason Kincaid, that's a pretty solid start to a new roster.

Except I don't expect Delirious to do anything productive with those guys. Rush already feels like another token black guy doing flips who'll get lost in the shuffle and never achieve anything until he leaves a few years from now, Lee and Taylor are getting the War Machine push which isn't a good thing when you see how irrelevant Hanson and Rowe are today, Kamaitachi and White will do just fine because Gedo is holding Delirious' balls while whispering "not another Watanabe" in his ear over and over, and we'll see about the other three frankly.

Yeah because Watanabe is doing so awful now after his time in ROH.

He's the most successful young lion they've had in years. Hence why they've sent over Jay White and now Komatsu/Tanaka are starting in the states as well to work for ROH.

Thelone's point wasn't that Watanabe didn't develop in ROH, but that he wasn't used in way that New Japan was expecting. He was sent to ROH to learn, but ROH just had him in random undercard matches for 99% of his tenure. If I recall correctly, there was a period of time where they were barely using him at all, and New Japan was quite unhappy. Compare that to White, who has gotten to work with Jay Briscoe, Christopher Daniels, and MCMG as well as having matches against other undercard talent.

[Big Red Machine]

The fact that they're finally looking beyond seminars is really encouraging.

They really aren't though. Kamaitachi and White are New Japan guys on excursion and we still don't know what the deal is with Ospreay and Scurll. The other guys you and others mentionned are very much seminar dudes.

But they are bringing in new talent. Sure they may not be pushed as best as they could right now, but bringing in Lio Rush, Kamaitachi, Jay White, Punisher Martinez, Shane Taylor, Keith Lee, maybe Jonathan Gresham, maybe Jason Kincaid, that's a pretty solid start to a new roster.

Except I don't expect Delirious to do anything productive with those guys. Rush already feels like another token black guy doing flips who'll get lost in the shuffle and never achieve anything until he leaves a few years from now, Lee and Taylor are getting the War Machine push which isn't a good thing when you see how irrelevant Hanson and Rowe are today, Kamaitachi and White will do just fine because Gedo is holding Delirious' balls while whispering "not another Watanabe" in his ear over and over, and we'll see about the other three frankly.

I don't understand why you think Hanson and Rowe are so irrelevant. They are just outside of the tag title picture, which they should be able to be moved back into at any time, seeing as how they haven't been beaten cleanly and recently had a title match scheduled that never took place because they were attacked backstage.

[Thelone]

Thelone's point wasn't that Watanabe didn't develop in ROH, but that he wasn't used in way that New Japan was expecting. He was sent to ROH to learn, but ROH just had him in random undercard matches for 99% of his tenure. If I recall correctly, there was a period of time where they were barely using him at all, and New Japan was quite unhappy. Compare that to White, who has gotten to work with Jay Briscoe, Christopher Daniels, and MCMG as well as having matches against other undercard talent.

Exactly. Watanabe was used as a glorified jobber during his excursion and worked crummy indies in the New York area because ROH didn't even book him for months.

I don't understand why you think Hanson and Rowe are so irrelevant. They are just outside of the tag title picture, which they should be able to be moved back into at any time, seeing as how they haven't been beaten cleanly and recently had a title match scheduled that never took place because they were attacked backstage.

Don't worry, they'll be the inaugural trios champions with Taven.

[monster mafia]

that taylor/ lee- war machine feud is pretty cool.

[famicommander]

Wade Barrett incoming?

http://wrestlinginc.com/wi/news/2016/09 ... ark-match/

Could be huge for the UK tour

[TYFDK]

I want to see him in ROH more than Cody Rhodes.

[Big Red Machine]

I don't understand why you think Hanson and Rowe are so irrelevant. They are just outside of the tag title picture, which they should be able to be moved back into at any time, seeing as how they haven't been beaten cleanly and recently had a title match scheduled that never took place because they were attacked backstage.

Don't worry, they'll be the inaugural trios champions with Taven.

That doesn't explain to me why you think they're irrelevant.

[monster mafia]

barrett...nice,maybe is a thing for the uk tour but..interesting.

[Thelone]

That doesn't explain to me why you think they're irrelevant.

Alright, I'll try to explain, but it's going to be a weird one.

There is a bit of a split between the juniors and the heavyweights in the tag division. Teams like War Machine and Lee/Taylor are mostly facing jobbers and only sometimes other teams, while the junior teams don't have jobber matches and are mostly facing each other. To me, it feels like the juniors are the "real" tag division while the heavyweights are more of a sideshow than part of the division.

[BurningHammer]

The Wade thing might be more to do with the management team that Nana is involved with, although I think he grew up in the Preston area or is at least a PNE fan then I could see him being brought in as a helping hand for the Liverpool night. If he is being brought in as a full or part time talent than that would be great as I think he certainly has the ability to go, possibly far more than he showed in WWE.

[Big Red Machine]

That doesn't explain to me why you think they're irrelevant.

Alright, I'll try to explain, but it's going to be a weird one.

There is a bit of a split between the juniors and the heavyweights in the tag division. Teams like War Machine and Lee/Taylor are mostly facing jobbers and only sometimes other teams, while the junior teams don't have jobber matches and are mostly facing each other. To me, it feels like the juniors are the "real" tag division while the heavyweights are more of a sideshow than part of the division.

But that split is non-existent.

[Wilson]

Well, War Machine is definitely now less relevant. They have had minor roles at the last two PPVs and have been practically wrestling job talent or Lee & Taylor to exclusion. By comparison, they appear irrelevant to where they were on the card at the beginning of the year.

Which is not to say that they they’re being misused. I think this is the role they are suited for. As workers they’re both completely OK, but, as big men, they are already being showed up by Lee & Taylor. Investing in War Machine hasn’t yielded much for ROH yet.

[Big Red Machine]

Well, War Machine is definitely now less relevant. They have had minor roles at the last two PPVs and have been practically wrestling job talent or Lee & Taylor to exclusion. By comparison, they appear irrelevant to where they were on the card at the beginning of the year.

Which is not to say that they they’re being misused. I think this is the role they are suited for. As workers they’re both completely OK, but, as big men, they are already being showed up by Lee & Taylor. Investing in War Machine hasn’t yielded much for ROH yet.

But that's because they haven't been used well. If they had had a proper tag title reign with some real feuds and their feud with the Briscoes was pushed the way it deserved to be and War Machine's win wasn't made an afterthought by losing the belts the next night, I think people would be singing a different tune. It's not that ROH's investment in War Machine hasn't paid off. It's that ROH has mismanaged the portfolio.

[Wilson]

If they held the belts past the tapings, I think most people would’ve been singing the tune of, “War Machine is not over yet, huh?” They can have good matches (and sometimes great ones, when their style and the booking complement each other), but they have not caught on the way they ought to considering their push.

Of course booking is integral ROH’s investments. For what the amount of resources put into them, War Machine have not been a good investment; I see that as pretty matter-of-fact despite their talent. Same went for The Kingdom last year and for O'Reilly for most of this year.

I’m not campaigning that Hanson and Rowe are busts, but, gosh, how can you not be disappointed in them if you were ROH?

[JigsawVs.Jason]

Urg, I hope they stay away from booking all those WWE names just because of their names. Barrett is atrocious and should never be in an ROH ring.

[HonorLives]

Urg, I hope they stay away from booking all those WWE names just because of their names. Barrett is atrocious and should never be in an ROH ring.

This

[Big Red Machine]

Urg, I hope they stay away from booking all those WWE names just because of their names. Barrett is atrocious and should never be in an ROH ring.

This

Really? I always thought he was pretty good (not, like, so good they should use him no matter what, but still good), and he's a pretty great promo.

[DXvsNWO1994]

I like Wade Barrett. He's a guy who I think was really underutilized in WWE. I'd say he's at least worth a shot, if ROH wants to bring him in. If he does well, then great. If he bombs, then don't book him again.

[Mike Adamle]

With Dixie moving out of the TNA throne I'd love if Corgan could get the fact that they're not much more than an indy company through his head and help them by partnering up with ROH and allow a talent exchange similar to what we have with NJPW and CMLL.